Drowning in debt? Water litigator warns of future shocks
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This cracked earth was, until recently, the bottom of the Ragged Mountain Reservoir, drained in anticipation of dam construction. Braverman notes that dredging requires no draining.hawes spencer -
Until this suit, Braverman quietly pursued a home-based career as an immigration attorney.hawes spencer - click to view more photos
Citizens who have seen their water bills triple over the past decade are facing another wave of price hikes and a suddenly-doubled debt load that could cause financial trouble. And they have just lost one of their three reservoirs in the lead-up to what could become a dry summer. These are just a few of the "absurd" things that made lawyer Stanton Braverman mad enough to sue.
In a Monday morning press conference at his home office in the Belmont neighborhood, the 70-year-old Braverman– who goes by "Stan"– blames the Rivanna Water & Sewer Authority for wasting a pile of public money and running the risk of losing a century's worth of water assets.
Moreover, Braverman warns that the public could find itself at the mercy of a monopolistic private business that swoops in if Authority bonds fall into default. Such a nightmare scenario is Braverman's speculation, but he contends that the possibility looms large because the Authority has failed to secure enough cash for its buying spree, which includes contracting last month for a large but unfunded dam in the Ragged Mountain Natural Area.
"They seem to have put the cart before the horse," says Braverman, who sued the Authority and the other three water-dealing governments last month. "You don't sign a contract for a $21 million dam before you line up financing," he says.
Despite holding a pile of cash bigger than the General Fund of the City of Charlottesville, the Authority has been advised to double its debt load to fund a slate of construction projects that it tallies at $174 million by the end of fiscal 2015. That means that in order to service the new debt, water/sewer rates, which have already tripled since 1999, must climb another 26 percent.
The new price hikes were buried in a report released last July that indicates that some of the Authority's infrastructure spending will come from the current cash stash but that the majority, $72.2 million, must come from new bonds, i.e. debt.
"Financial consultants commend water authority as it prepares to borrow for infrastructure," was the headline over a story on the topic by Charlottesville Tomorrow's Brian Wheeler, whose relentless cheerleading for a new dam downplayed the fact that only $44 million of the $143 million cost to build the new Ragged Mountain dam/pipeline system is on the Authority's wish list. That means that the vast majority of the Community Water Supply Plan– nearly $100 million more– lies off the capital budget and is therefore unaccounted for, even with the near-term rate hikes.
Braverman notes that the planned debt service depends not only on pushing higher water/sewer rates onto the public but also on ambitious growth estimates that have the local population nearly doubling in 50 years. The lawyer warns that if revenue fails to keep pace with payments to bond-holders, the bonds will fall into default; and that's when a private firm could scoop them up for, say, 15 cents on the dollar. And because the Authority is attempting to back the bonds with the water infrastructure, a private company could own the reservoirs.
Rivanna Authority director Tom Frederick, who communicates with the Hook only via electronic message, declined to comment beyond the court pleadings.
Braverman notes that under Frederick, the Authority has been buying financial advice from a Richmond-based firm called Davenport & Company whose dealings recently drew a lawsuit from Fluvanna County for allegedly enriching itself at the expense of taxpayers. Davenport, which did not immediately respond to a request for comment, has denied the allegation.
Davenport's papers readily reveal that the proposed bond deal for Charlottesville and Albemarle will cost citizens a 26 percent price hike over the next four years. But the potential of losing a century's worth of public infrastructure– pumps and pipes in addition to the reservoirs– is what really riles the litigator.
"Listening to Davenport talk," says Braverman, "is like listening to your stockbroker saying MCI or Enron is a good investment."
Thus far, Davenport has been hired for occasional advice, but if the company ends up winning the right to issue the Authority's bonds, it could earn up to $1.5 million in "underwriting expenses and fees," according to its own presentation. If that happens, Davenport will become part of a lucrative if not necessarily noble trifecta of companies. Previously, engineering firm Gannett Fleming, which launched the dam, and MMM Design, which declared the Belmont Bridge unworthy of preservation, have parlayed government consulting deals into monumental construction projects of questionable necessity– along with six- and even seven-figure design fees.
As for the new reservoir, it would focus all local water supply in one pool with over two billion gallons of storage. Such a system has long drawn criticism from environmentalists such as the Sierra Club for putting all the drinking water in one place along busy Interstate 64.
In addition to the alleged ecological and financial vulnerabilities, though, Braverman raises a legal one. He contends that the dam scheme ignores Virginia's long tradition of following the Dillon Rule, a concept that denies localities the right to do things not explicitly allowed by law.
"On the Dillon Rule alone I'm going to prevail," says Braverman, noting that Albemarle County suffered a major wake-up call in January when, in a case called called Sinclair v. Cingular, the Virginia Supreme Court cited the Dillon Rule when invalidating Albemarle's attempt to delegate zoning decisions to its Planning Commission.
Braverman concedes that just like eventually-prevailing Albemarle litigant Kent Sinclair, he may lose under a lower-level judge, but he vows to quickly move up to the Virginia Supreme Court or to federal court to press his case. Charlottesville Circuit Court Judge Cheryl Higgins has granted the Rivanna Authority an expedited hearing this Thursday, April 19 in the Authority's emergency move to green-light its bonds.
Braverman's press conference took place April 16, coincidentally on the same day that the Ragged Mountain Natural Area, the 980-acre preserve that holds the drained reservoir, closed its trails to the public for over a year of planned dam construction.
52 comments
So, all the trump about how rates in the city would go down, was naturally one more big fib in the endlessly corrupt of utility mafia known as the RWSA. So, in four years, it will be 50 bucks a month for water for about 1500 gallons of water a month. Wow. Imagine what its really going to be when they do this project. I guess we want to make sure that people making 8.50$/hr are paying 100$ for some old overweight wealthy retirees who scream at Tea Party meetings, while making sure their new condos are subsidized by the people they claim are welfare clients.
America has really become such a wonderful national. Freedom Fries for the wealthy, potato/stone soup for the rest.
So if a tanker truck flips into the resivoir how long before we can drink the water?
Caaseonia, if everybody pays for the water they consume then that is the fair way to divide the bill. The 8.50 an hour person will not be subsidizing anyone.
However.... the hook up fee for all the new houses theold overweight wealthy retirees buy will certainly subsidize that 8.50 an hour persons bills.
But keep trying. Just remember that the game is called pin the tail on the donkey not the elephant.
This is a bad idea and is pushed by greedy corporations exploiting ignorant liberals. Just like the car manufactuers who pretent to lobby against vehicle safety features so they become mandatory where they can charge whatever they want to sell you the parts later.
The Belmont bridge doesn't need replacement either it needs an overhaul. People just want something new the cost be damned.
I would donate to support this lawsuit.
The city owns ( or did until they turned control over to RWSA ) the reservoirs and dams. The 3 city councilors ( Huja, Szakos and Galvin) that voted for this fiscally irresponsible deal for city residents should be recalled.
Anyone mad enough yet ?
Truly this isn't "political" this is the fact that there is bad management in all government out there period. We the people need to audit our governments - after all, they are spending OUR money even before they obtain it and this goes from the small town to the top. If our incomes are able to be audited - then so should theirs! I'm just sayin'...and I am so tired of the mis-management. If a company was run the way our governments - oh, wait a sec, they are too and that is why we are all angry, overworked, underpaid, overbilled and so sick and tired of it all!
Well, except Bill, that's not how it really works, when you are financing projects like this it most certainly is a subsidy for developers and the residents they sell to by the 8.50/hr person. And if you truly understood the basic business model and cost sharing in large pools for expensive items, I don't think you would be so quick to huff up about 'socialism' just because it happens to be a programm from a general fund versus a private entity or a public corporation.
When an entity like the RWSA borrows money to provide additional water works and processing for big homes in new developments, and then shares that out with everyone, then they are placing the burden on the older water users and less affluent. See, that additional debt would not be needed if those homes were not built, and their users were not sucking down more water, and those rates would not go up. Now, if the RWSA were to place the burden of the additional debt service only on the developers who need that infrastructure, with no affect on the rates, then I would be inclined to agree with you, but they don't. That hook up fee doesn't cover very much of the true cost. If it did, there would be no reason to borrow to provide the increased water works.
It is especially aggregious when it is abundantly clear that the city does not need any water with what they have in those 3 storage areas, and their rate payers have already had the rates hiked to cover expanded development costs, and really includes those in the county too.
This type of cost sharing is no different that what you rage about when we talk about education, or health care. you don't seem to want to pick up the added cost of all those less affluent who couldn't afford health care.
Of course, even private health insurance operates the same way, by spreading the cost of those with poorer genes on those with better genes all the time.
I agree this is mismanagement from government on both sides of the aisles, but it most definitely does have a political orientation driving it, when you look at the major interests involved. It just shows how corruption can be find on both sides of the coin to meet an agenda that most certainly is not in the best interests of the taxpayers or the ratepayers.
Hey Bill, I do still agree with you on the bridge, and pretty much what is driving it. I just disagree with the idea that the lower incomes aren't being exploited for the benfit of the more affluent and developers.
We know our leaders lied to us about the need for water, about the supply of water, about the cost to dredge, and about the hidden water in the county reservoirs. And the people did nothing. The welfare state will remain quiet on the couches in subsidized housing as long as the checks keep coming, their snap cards are renewed and the utilities are paid by the city. Life on the plantation is good so keep quiet.
And those who do produce, pay taxes, also remain quiet. Ah the benefits of the economics of poverty are so good. City payroll, school payroll, university payroll, health insurance payroll all to make the system work. Just vote Democratic and keep the plantation going smoothly.
God Help America especially Charlottesville
Are you telling me I will have much higher water rates. Well Mayor Huja and Councilor Kristen Szakos told me that rates would NOT go up. Who are you to question them? Why don't you just shut up and let the elected ones rule?
So how many of you who are head up over this actually bothered to send the judge a letter? Are willing to show up at a protest? Are going to support getting this thing undone now, once and for all?
Judges generally don't take bullying very well. A good legal argument is respected by the court. The Citizens for Sustainable Water leadership complained and complained but would not sue when the time was ripe. Now all that is left to litigate is process in that the process was illegal.
But legal process was followed without legal contest maybe because the Democrats did not want to rock the Democratic boat.
Now the deed is done, the lies told and accepted. The bonding may get upset and new language used. But Charlottesville will sleep in the bed made by Mayor Huja, Councilor Szakos and Councilor Galvin. They gave away hundreds of millions of assets and signed on to $60++ million of off balance sheet debt. THE CITY PEOPLE got screwed. So shake hands with these three as you pass them on the mall. They worked hard at their jobs on City Council.
I am not sure it is a done deed. If the attorney is right, they will have rewrite the agreement, and get it passed a referendum. That might not go according to plan. And if this judge smells bullying, they might work extra hard to find what they need to put it back on an even keel.
Caseonia,
I certianly do understand the way it works. What I feel you are forgetting is that a vacant piece of land that is finally developed has been paying property taxes into the system for a century while consuming nothing. Those monies were used to build the current infrastructure, and now it is their turn to join the party. Hook up fees run into the tens and hundreds of thousands and if it is a business it then becomes a slave to the government collecting sales taxes and paying expensive property taxes even if the buildinmg is vacant for years because the economy tanked.
The problem we have is that we have too many people in government on both sides who are trying to instill their too liberal or too conservative ways upon the populace and the taxpayers are stuck with the costs of the wildly swinging pendulum as the election cycles bring in dumber and dumber zealots who "know" what we need.
I have no problem with funding education or healthcare for the poor so long as the money is spent wisely. It is not and no one is addressing that.
The simple solution would be to build a lower dam 100 yards downstream of the current dam and dredge the current silt into the newly created pool ,and then slowly and constantly dumping the daily estimate of silt over that dam so it can flow downstream as god intended. (that would be an imaginary god for all you atheists..but work with me here)
Of course there is no REAL money to be made so that won't fly...
While financing this expansion during a time when financing is dirt cheap, thanks to the Fed, is sensible - it's only sensible if the expansion is really needed. Dredging would have solved so much, so much more cheaply.
We should not be paying for this massive expansion - the costs should be passed on to the people creating the extra demand on the system. Bill Marshall - you're flat-out wrong: the rate hikes wouldn't be needed to pay for the new capacity if the cost of hookup fees - the additional demand on the system - covered the costs of the expansion. So, yes, everyone who currently has service and is seeing a rate hike is subsidizing the developers who are adding load to the system. The expanded sewer line for Albemarle Place is a perfect example of this.
This is the "welfare state" - it is corporate welfare for the developers. That is not minimum wage workers - and distributing the burden in a "flat tax" rate to current users of the system does not mean the benefits of the expansion flow to the existing users - the current system would serve them.
This is not, in fact, due to lazy welfare recipients sitting on couches - it's due to right-wing pro-growth "entrepreneurs" figuring out how to milk the taxpayer.
I do certainly agree that this needs to stop, and now. Hookup costs should rise dramatically in order to cover any growth or expansion - make the people - developers and their customers - who benefit from the expansion pay for for the expansion - isn't that the conservative ideology: fee for service government? Certainly Huja should have known better though Szakos and Galvin are unsurprising to me.
The price of this financial and ecological disaster is always quoted at
$143,000,000. This presumes that (based on the Wiley/Wilson pipeline
report that the pipeline use the future Western Bypass.
The report further states that if the Bypass is not available, 80 easements
will have to be paid for or leased driving up the cost exponentially as well
as taking years due to lawsuits that would be plentiful with all these easements.
Further, as far as a year to complete -- the engineer (Schnabel) has stated at
'a public meeting that the time to scrape and blast the required 620,00 cu. ft.
of earth for the dam would be two years.
I
I've said before, someone really needs to make a documentary about what's going on here. I wish I had the skills/equipment. I know someone else who cares does and I'd be glad to donate to help fund it. I'm sure there are a lot of us.
@ city resident RE: recalling those responsible for this mess--
http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+cod+24.2-233
§ 24.2-233. Removal of elected and certain appointed officers by courts.
1. For neglect of duty, misuse of office, or incompetence in the performance of duties when that neglect of duty, misuse of office, or incompetence in the performance of duties has a material adverse effect upon the conduct of the office,
The petition must be signed by a number of registered voters who reside within the jurisdiction of the officer equal to ten percent of the total number of votes cast at the last election for the office that the officer holds.
The last council election had a total of 19,629 votes. I'm pretty sure that 1963 signatures would be easy to get. At that point the court would consider the charges. One thing that might be interesting about a court hearing is that information that otherwise has been kept from the public could be subpoenaed and made public. That alone would be a valuable public service.
Sorry for the typo . Does anyone know if citizens can speak on the 19th?
Recall the scoundrels. BRILLIANT and very accomplishable hopefully before they give away even more. Just don't replace them with any Citizens for Sustainable Water. Both sides are incapable.
See no response to RECALL.
The "plantation mentality" continues. "Might loses my check if I speak out". The economics of poverty rules in an absence of real leadership.
Hi Bill, I am not sure I can agree with this statement:
'What I feel you are forgetting is that a vacant piece of land that is finally developed has been paying property taxes into the system for a century while consuming nothing.'
All of our property was vacant at one time, and the tax burden for it varied according to the times from nothing to high. I think it is fair to say that tax rates on rural properties are substantially lower than those already developed, and Albemarle County is an absolute classic. Tax rates historically have been quite low, and yet they do still consume services, such as fire and police protection. So this idea that property has been sitting 'unused' and not using services while paying taxes is a bit of a red herring.
Another point you make about the need for growth to somehow have an improving tax base is one that is simply not sustainable, just as its not correct. It ignores the point of dminishing returns, and the idea of a maximzation point. The time has gone for people to think of redeveloping, and doing more with less, something called productivity, ot just sprawling more and more.
Thank you Mr. Braverman. Thousands of people are rooting for you . I am also willing to help fund this suit . How can I contribute ?
The Charlottesville Open Government Alliance is collecting donations right now specifically to support Mr. Braverman's suit. While he is donating his time, he anticipates considerable other costs, such as filing fees, deposition fees, etc. All money donated at this time will be used to support the suit. Please see CvilleAlliance.com for more information about the suit and to donate online. Or, you can send a check to the Charlottesville Open Government Alliance at 129 Goodman St., Charlottesville, Va, 22902.
On Wall St. water is now called "Blue Gold." According to a government report entitled Global Water Security, by 2030 the demand for water will be 40 percent above sustainable water supplies. The big business behind this deal knows how much our water is worth. Corporations such as Monsanto, Royal Dutch Shell, and Nestle (as in our case) are banking on it. This deal is setting us up to loose because they wrote it.Wake up citizens of Albemarle! You could find yourself at the mercy of a monopolistic private business that swoops in if RWS Authority bonds fall into default. Google Jefferson County Alabama, the largest municipal bankruptcy ever!
One question - how can any judge validate the RWSA dam plan and put our water assets at risk if the RWSA
defaults ? I would be curious what Mr Heilberg or any other lawyer thinks of this.. Sounds risky if the judge approved their plans and then a default occurred - would the
Judge stand to be held liable as well?
Thank you Ms. Salinas. A Braverman victory will be a victory for all water ratepayers and a rebuff of the corruption that has taken hold in our city.
To those who say things like: Where were you? Why didn't you speak? If people cared, opposed, had other ideas, etc., why haven't you said as much? I would just say that some of us have done nothing else but speak out for a very long time both to oppose what we see as wrong and to support what we see as right. Also, to the extent possible, we have voted against those you now suggest recalling and in support of those who would do better. If you don't know that, either you haven't paid enough attention or public media have failed to do their jobs. Or both.
Go Stan! I hope you prevail.
Does anyone know if anyone is writing a citizens' amicus brief (if such things exist), or if people can sign on to the suit?
Has anyone else noticed that the Hook staff are the only print journalists in town willing to take on those in power and allow the people's voice to be heard . And to do the hard work researching where our money is going. We all owe them a huge debt of gratitude.
Old Timer, I beg to differ. While the property taxes for vacant land are lower compared to developed land, the tax bill difference is in the improvements on the land not the land itself. Raw land is a profit to the taxpayers and not a burden and every property owner has as much right to develop within the law as any parcel already developed. Raw land does not use the schools or libraries. Who paid for YOUR infrastucture? It was the previous taxpayers and current taxpayers paying off current loans. Albemarle pPace paid millions in proffers and will continue to pay millions more in sales tax collections, real estate collections and water bills.
If we do not want development than we need to raise taxes, eminant domain all the vacant land and place it in a conservation easement. Just because someone has not built doesn't mean the person that built last year has seniority. There arevacant lots worth over a million bucks on route 29 that are paying 75k plus a year for "fire" protection. If they remain undeveloped for a decade that should more than cover their share of hooking up to the water system for a bank or CVS.
As far as growth goes it is about peoples rights to make sure they are treated fairly. The government has an equal oblogation to all property owners to provide infrastructure within current zoning. If someone needs more than they have the proffer process to get it.
Growth will occur, people want to live here and people cannot simply hold onto land perpetually without selling. So the city and county should regulate growth within reasonable limits and respectful of peoples rights. If that gets expensive then we deal with it as best we can. If we don't fine a family for moving into a three bedroom house and sending 6 kids to the public schools at a cost of 100k plus a year while paying only 2600 in property taxes then why are we trying to lynch a guy for opening a gas station?
We will need to increase water capacity the question is how. It seems that the way they have gone about it is pretty irresponsible.
One question I have is can we sell our excess water to other counties until we need it?
"If we do not want development than we need to raise taxes,"
Not necessarily. See, that's the fallacy that I am saying you and some individuals seem to live under. It defies the one underlying economics principle that I know both I and Caesonia and a few others have used with you - productivity. Healthy populations in nature are actually fairly static, and we have to start thinking the same way. Some people have children, some don't. We upgrade and repair schools, but we don't need to build them.We consume goods and services, and we can take on debt for upgrades to current systems as the old debt is retired. With inflation tax revenue will increase as salaries do, but the rate does not necessarily need to go up. Civilizations collapse because they do grow without check. Just look at Easter Island and the Mayan culture.
The reality is we have lots commercial space already available, with infrstructure hooked up. That is what is needed to be developed.
I disagree that I do not require services for my undeveloped land. It's not much, but I do require them. I pay a lower tax rate for the lower demand. None of that has anything do with your 'right' to develop within the law - which is aside step from the topic at hand - or placing those costs on other members in our society.
@Bill Marshal - Old Timer is exactly right: the only reason we have to raise taxes is to pay for the new schools and new infrastructure - none of which would be needed if we didn't have the "growth". You've actually got it backwards. Of course, it's impossible to get a man to understand a thing when his livelihood depends on him not understanding it.
You crack me up: you blame everything on "Liberals" and "entitlement" and "welfare" and then proceed to argue that you are ENTITLED to develop your land, and ENTITLED to push the costs off on others, with the justification that somehow in the future the added revenues will cover it all.
Albemarle Place proffers were insufficient to cover the cost of the upgraded sewer line, which is why it is so shamefully scandalous that the "Liberals" who actually LIVE in the CITY of Charlottesville, not the freeloading surrounding county, have to pay for an Albemarle development and not even get the tax revenues from that development!
You are certainly free to develop any land you own - nobody owes you a dime for not developing it - but you can also foot the entire bill for all the infrastructure improvements needed to service it, instead of expecting others to pay your tab for you while you profit from the freeloading. The existing water and sewer infrastructure was already paid for and financed by users of the system. You want to connect? You pay the fees to BUY IN to the club.
Or are you a secret free-loading "liberal"? Do you park your land in the "land-use" tax dodge to avoid paying the full tax bill? That would go a long way to answering the question. "Land use" maintains the fiction that you shouldn't pay for infrastructure (schools, water, sewer, police) because the land doesn't "use" those services.
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Your inability to understand basic economics does not mmakwe you right...
If a person owns a vacant lot on Route 29 worth two million dollars they pay 148k a year in property taxes each and every year. It is sits there empty with no trees on it and the owner has to pay to clean up the trash people dump on it it uses no county services. So if you add up 100 years of property taxes they have paid probably two to three MILLION dollars to send your kids to school , build your water and road system and feed your offsping who are too lazy to get a job. So now when they want to build a gas station on it to provide competition that will keep the gas price competitive YOU want to stop them. It does not work that way. If you want to buy the land and pay the property taxes on it to keep it empty go ahead, but they have a RIGHT and have PRE P{AID their fair share to tap into the system. The hook up fees are alrady expensive and you want more. There is not a single homeowner in the city or county that paid up front for their share of the infrastucture and it is not only illegal but immoral to place obstacles in peoples way who may have owned land here for hundreds of years because it doesn't meet your vision of the area.
Or lets look at it another way... the average family in C-ville pays 2500 a year in Property taxes, so after 20 years they have paid 50k . Well they sent 3 kids to 12 years of school each at 15k a year (3x12x15= 540k) so they contributed 50k but spent 540k on school alone, PLUS they drove on the roads used the libraries and parks, were activley protected by the police and fire/ rescue and whatever other "services" they consumed (street plowing, streetlights etc etc) Meanwhile the vacant lot next door paid probably 1/3 of that 16.6k) since there was no house on the lot and used nothing. We are a half a million in the hole on you and now that he wants to build a house and raise a family and you want him to pay 100k upfront for the priviliege. Talk about selfish and greedy!
The current water system was bought and paid for over time as were the schools firetrucks and public housing. It is an ongoing expense and as people decide the time has come to use their land they are entitled to AT LEAST what you consumed.
Nobody made you pay 100k upfront when this resivoir was built.
This area will grow and all taxpayers should be equal under the law. The city and counties inability to save money for a rainy day should not be shouldered on the backs of people who have contrubuted taxes for decades and not consumed any in return but now want to develop what they paid for. They have as much right to be here as anybody.
"If a person owns a vacant lot on Route 29 worth two million dollars they pay 148k a year in property taxes each and every year. It is sits there empty with no trees on it and the owner has to pay to clean up the trash people dump on it it uses no county services."
Bill, what are you talking about? I thought we were just talking about 'empty undeveloped land.' According to you land has no real value unless its got buildings on it, which is malarky.
The county tax rate is .742/100. That's 2,000,000/100*.742 = 14,840. Where do you get off with 148 k a year? And when you develop that, does that money go directly to pay the cost of the new infrastructure, or does that cost get shuffled on on other water users through increased rates? What if the costs of 100 additional households water infratsurcutre were deducted from those taxes, would you still see a profit to the community? How about we include the roads? Police officers? Firemen? Would you still see it?
Most communities are finding you don't see a profit. you see taxes go up on everyone and the older residents share the cost. For nuttin.
My dad Rocky and I just got back from
Big Bear lake up San Bernadino way.
The fishing was great.
Here at my trailer with my friend Angel, my
attorney and sometime girlfriend Beth Davenport
and Rocky just playing a friendly game of cards.
We thought this drama would be moving along
But things must go real slow in your neck of the woods.
Who is this fellow Braveheart ?
Beth says an attorney who has himself for a client .....well you know.
"On the Dillion rule alone I'm going to prevail"
Beth just thinks that's a hoot.
Doesn't 't think he could pass the bar exam in California she tells me.
Stick with immigration law, and Beth hopes Braveheart is a bit better at that.
All the sturm und drang ....really, have to say the attorney sounds like Cassandra.
Does this attorney have a series 7 license ?
Involved in the munipal bond market is he ?
We called a friend back east who traded munis for years
...he read the offering , and all 20 or so previous underwritings
For the RWSA that Davenport did....and asks Angel and myself
...well...what's the issue ?? ..pretty straight forward stuff.
He tells us this Davenport firm usually underwrites more than seven
Billion dollars in bonds each year...they are a pretty good sized regional
player ....
What's this Braveheart attorney talking about ??
If you want help , and think there is some issue
I can be hired at my rate of 200 dollars a day , plus expenses .
Think I can get to the bottom of it all, and find out what's on
This fella Krugerrands mind,.... he seems to be the guy in charge.
On the other side
If necessary I'll call Sgt Dennis Becker downtown and he "ll
Get the info you need
So just give me a call
555-2368
Leave a message after the beep
Back to the card game.
Jim Rockford
Jim Rockford, you're just too cool for school. Sounds like you fancy yourself a poet. But you're just another lawyer. Who are you representing? Sounds like you have an interest. Why don't you take your smooth talk somewhere else? Get back to your card game- Or take the time to learn about the issue. Personal attacks on Braverman are cheap shots.
How it got this far is terrible. Hopefully the courts will protect us from ourselves.
Hey Rocky, sounds like Braveheart has gotten under your skin. Sounds like he is making you a bit uncomfortable. Maybe he is doing some acupuncture on you and bring all the bad out. your reaction tells me that tomorrow there might be some concessions to Braveheart. Were you the overpriced attorney who missed that Virginia Statute about using public assets as collateral? Thats a pretty big miss for specialists, dontcha think? Or are you just King O'Connoll mad that someone is taking you on that's used to frying bigger fish?
In either case, don't call me, and I won't call you, because I am pretty sure I will find you in the courthouse.
y'all are gonna look like fools when this happens and none of the dire predictions come true. You've worked yourselves up in a lather over idle speculation and emotional reactions to non-existent threats.
Charlottesville is in a regional water authority agreement with other public institutions such as the county and UVa. C'ville does not and cannot simply look at its own needs due to this agreement and regional authority. You all act like this truth doesn't exist. This is reality and the real world and if you don't want to accept reality or the real world, then you find yourselves very frustrated. I believe that frustration is the source of most of the anger and angst exhibited by the comments here.
Someone mentioned how valuable and coveted fresh water will be in 2030, not realizing that this is precisely why creating an abundant supply is so important. The notion that the RWSA will one day go into default is ludicrous, but appears to be the last straw to grasp for the misguided opponents of this plan.
Seriously, you all are preaching to a very small choir of believers. The rest of us have realized how important having abundant water will be and that is why, time and time again the voters of the area, Charlottesville and Albemarle, have voted for those public officials in favor of this plan.
You've lost. You can delay with this lawsuit, but it too will fail eventually.
We'll see. Aint over til its over.
Have you read either of the agreements? The issue is not whether the city shuld plan their water usage with the county. The issue is that in doing so, the city should not sacrefice its own needs, and certainly not accept a deal that cheats its own ratepayers.
The county gets 80 years of water and the city 30? What kind of plan is that for a sustainable future?
Both should at least get 50 under the deal.
This thing might go through, but if nothing else, the city will get a better deal out of the complete raping of their assets.
Oh, and the four party agreement can be dissolved, so saying somehow they are obligated to it is nonsense. The city can get out of it anytime they want to. Which is what has the county so scared.
I would sign a petition for a recall. For this and for lacking the foresight to keep the Belmont Bridge in good repair.
Meanwhile, back at the ranch, some idiot believes what a politician has to say about anything, least of all RWSA. Oh, it rained all day yesterday.
Rockford files!!! A cool show. Remember in the last drought when they asked people to pee outdoors!!
Recall elections are legal in Virginia for local elections - when do we start ? Huja, Szakos and Galvin have to go.
http://ballotpedia.org/wiki/index.php/James_Holley_recall,_Portsmouth,_V...
"How can any judge validate the RWSA dam plan and put our water assets at risk if the RWSA defaults?"
Nancy, Nancy, Nancy......
The time to have headed that off at the pass was, one minute before and not after the recent draining of the Ragged Mountain Reservoir. The one thing a lot of us get duped to repeat overlooking is what "A" in "RWSA" stand for. It is an Authority and behaves in manner like its own little tin-plated jurisdiction. It's incorrigible ace in a hole is an all continued compliance with the slew of pressed EPA, DEQ and State Water Control Board standards and regulations.
To brandish salt on this wound, RWSA knows commonwealth law is insulative toward it and three steps ahead anticipative to what will occur. Now even if RWSA were to dissolve, it will only serve to increase ratepayer rates. §15.2-5109 Dissolution for purposes of impractical would now be contrary, to manage and control city and county attributed costs forked over for it. Loss of a court case will add more to the bill, needless to say.
Ah, but this is Charlottesville - a world class anomally with citizens of the world (usually deemed University students) set smack dab in Virginia. Anybody know this particular judge? She could conceivable find RWSA acted with fiscally responsible resolve. Wallah, RWSA off the hook either way dissolved or not.
Let's pray RWSA Lord of the Flies Frederick is in a magnanimous disposition after acquittal, and his cadre on that board DON'T very quickly move to dissolve the entire authority.
@ non-resident taxpayer - When you use the loose term "growth", don't you really mean "population control," such as the blanketly high density residential planning and zoning type predominate in the city? Hey, don't let this stop the mirror-mirror complaints about the purveyors of new developement, of NOT paying for first time water sewer hook-ups. Besides, how do you think savy developers manage to keep the prices so low on those sprawling crackerbox McMansions?
As far as the recall effort, come back to me once more when you get around that hurdle doing with the city charter.
Mr. Braverman, if you and your team of the Charlottesville Open Government Alliance get caught and fail, the Secretary will disavow any knowledge of your activity. This thread will self destruct in ten seconds. Good Luck Stan.
I'm just a lttle curious, if we mountain folk diverted our streams and runs into large retention pools, before the greedy and corrupt ever received the flow. and provided it to our neighbors, at reasonable costs , how would that be received by Nestle? Or the Nature conservancy? or RWSA? Lawsuits? or worse? Just curious.
That sounds like an excellent idea!
Very wise Mountain Folk would send the politicos into a tizzy and defeat the big business charlatans (principally The Nature Conservancy evil empire)
For $2500 I'm driling a well....I want no part of this.