Snap: Biker getting a ticket

bout time! get em durrette!

Bicyclist want to share the road so they need to share the rules too. I find it very dangerous sharing some narrow roads in the area.

Silly waste of police resources. It's ridiculous that the same rules of the road should apply to cars and bicycles. The bicyclist is doing everyone a favor: She is not using up gasoline for short trips; she is not polluting the city's air; and she is reducing the number of cars on the road which makes things better for those who have to drive cars. By running a redlight she is only endangering herself. The police would do better to ticket drivers who are talking on cellphones.

Vivian, while everything you say is true it is highly unlikely that a bicyclist is going to run a redlight without looking both ways for approaching cars. The article doesn't make it clear whether such was the case in this instance. I still think it is silly for the rules to require a bicyclist to stand at a redlight until it turns green when there are no cars approaching the intersection. Because they are so vulnerable, bicyclists in traffic tend to be much more aware of their surroundings, than are drivers.

In response to the comment left by le penseur. You stated "It's ridiculous that the same rules of the road should apply to cars and bicycles." You may want to rethink that when a 10yr old child blasts into the intersection on their bike because they don't have to obey the same traffic laws as everyone else and you mow them down. IE: STOP signs mean just that STOP!
Endangering herself? Come on, do you honestly think that she's the only one in danger? What about the the driver of the other car that you swerve into to avoid hitting her, or the driver of the car behind you that slams into you because you suddenly slam on your brakes to avoid hitting the cyclist, or maybe injuring you as you hit that tree on the corner avoiding her. Granted the cyclist is doing wonders for our envrioment by reducing fuel comsumption and reducing air polution but is any of that really worth the loss of life that could result from cyclits not driving by the same rules as all motorists? One point I do agree on is ticketing drivers on cell phones, perticularly ones who are texting. Texting is against the law in VA but not talking on cell phones as of July 2010, there is no restriction on talking on a cell phone while driving for adult drivers. So ticketing an adult using a cell phone in VA is not going to happen.

tod e, you don't have any idea what she is thinking. She may have been thinking something along the lines of, "No cars coming, I'll just go on across." When you are standing at a corner do you wait for the "Walk" light to come on before you cross if there are no cars coming?

P-Locks, I0 year olds will blast through intersections regardless of what the law says. That's why drivers have to be extra careful in areas frequented by children. Drivers should be extra careful anyway, especially in congested areas. I never suggested that bicyclists shouldn't have to stop at redlights; they just should not be required to wait for the light to turn green before proceeding if there is no traffic approaching.

Commuting cyclists are one thing but I HIGHLY object to the rude, uncaring and dangerous behaviour of the recreational cyclists who peddle along on the narrow county roads. These people are a menace to everyone.
On certain roads bicycles ought to be prohibited completely. IE: Old Lynchburg Rd, Rt 20 N&S, the entire Free Union/Earlysville area to name just a few.

I would like to add a comment now that is totally revelant in reference to this enforcement. If Officer Durette was driving his usual issued police vehicle, it's a very inconspicuous unmarked vehicle with dark tinted glass. And it's not even the usual unmarked Crown Victoria you might expect to see. The cyclist most likely had no idea she was violating the law right in front of a cop.

As a matter of fact, his issued city vehicle has probably already paid for itself three fold because nobody spots it as a police vehicle until the blue lights and siren go on!!

Gasbag Self Ordained Expert, have there been a lot of accidents in Charlottesville involving bicyclists running redlights lately? If so then I am wrong and will agree that it's a good law and rigorous enforcement is necessary.

Le_Dumasse, you missed the point. No, the laws must be enforced, even the silly ones. Officer Durrette did a good job. I am questioning whether it is useful to require bicyclists, by law, to sit at a redlight until it turns green if there is no traffic. That doesn't make sense to me. Now that you mention it, it doesn't make sense for cars to have to remain stopped either. I'd be in favor of changing that law too.

I agree that the cyclist should be ticked. However I also find that being annoyed at waiting for a cyclist(s) on the back roads is somewhat absurd. You mean those 20 seconds it takes to wait are ruining your day? Finally, realize that most cyclists are also tax paying citizens that DRIVE and contribute to the roads as much as you do. What have you got against people exercising? I hate rude and arrogant cyclists as much as the next guy but give me a break, some people react to them like they are robbing their grandmother when all they are doing is inconveniencing you for 30 seconds. Be the bigger person and make sure you recognize not all cyclists are rude, just some of them.

The officer was doing his duty, enforcing the traffic laws. I hope they ticket all those people that ride bikes unsafely.

Taken straight from DMV's website: Bicycles are subject to the same laws as motor vehicles.

So if you ride a bike and want to share the road with cars you have to follow the same laws. If you don't like the law then get it changed. Quit whining about the police doing their job. One lousy ticket to a violator riding a bike shown in the newspaper and you'd think it was open season on bike riders. When you take the same responsibility driving down the road as a motor vehicle come back and talk to me. Otherwise grow up!

No, Christina, I'm a middle-aged male. My bike riding days are long past. In my experience motorists are even worse now (more aggressive and reckless) than they were back then, so maybe you are right. There is a lot of anger on the roadways. I was ticketed once for running two red lights at consecutive intersections on a bike back in my college days. There was no danger to anyone. I saw the way was clear and rode on through. Didn't think anything about it then and don't think anything about it now. Went to court and was fined $25.00 for running one light. The judge obviously thought it was stupid too, but he felt he had to do something. The only misadventure I ever had involving a car occurred when a driver pulled out of a sidestreet, after stopping at the stopsign, into my path. She was looking right at me as she pulled into the intersection. My front wheel hit her front left quarterpanel and I flipped over my handlebars onto the hood of her car and rolled off the other side to the asphalt. It was quite spectacular but no blood was shed. My bike was never the same. I will always defend the bicyclist. They are doing the right thing. Most people shouldn't be allowed behind the wheel of a car.

Also, a person on a bicycle is not heavy enough to cause the traffic light to change, at those lights that have the device that changes the light when it senses a car waiting. Early in the morning, when there are no cars near me to force the light to change, I am forced to go through the red light. It's completely stupid to stand there helplessly and wait for a car to come along.

Yeah, sounds like a real inconvenience Gasbag. You have to push down on the brake pedal and then push down all over again on the accelerator pedal. How do you do it?

She should have been ticketed for wearing Tevas outside of a whitewater rafting scenario.

I have seen some interesting things while driving downtown but yesterday was a first. A male on a bicycle cycling in the oncoming traffic lane causing all the cars to swerve (the bike lane was on the other side by me) and then hopping up on the sidewalk. There is an ordinance in Ch'vlle that makes it illegal to ride your bike on the sidewalk.

BB:

That's a pretty weak and flawed argument. If they live in the city, they pay property taxes. I would also assume the majority of bikers also own motor vehicles. I bike around town occasionally and I also own 3 vehicles for which I have to pay taxes/registration.

In fact, I would argue bikers should get a personal property tax break on their motorized vehicles. Bikes cause much less wear to the road compared to cars, take up less space on the roads and reduce congestion. Why should bikers have to pay the same auto-related tax rates as those who solely drive? If you like unfair taxation, go back up north, BB.

Joe, why should traffic convictions on a bicycle not affect a driver's license? If a person does pretty stupid things on a bicycle, they most likely do in vehicles as well.

I like the arguments about personal property taxes though, it's gotten me to thinking out loud. Since I currently own 8 automobiles, I think I should get a multi-vehicle discount. I can't drive all eight cars on the public highways at the same time. I also should be allowed to buy just one set of license plates and use them on whatever vehicle I am driving at the time. And I shouldn't have to pay insurance on 8 vehicles since I am only driving one at a time. Maybe if I buy myself a bicycle I can get in line for discounts of some type.

FYI - bikers don't share the road. They are pushed over into the gutters.

Kosmo is right, I've stopped biking around here because the drivers give no leeway and it makes it very dangerous to ride. It's a shame drivers can't take 10 seconds to slow down to pass a bike rider safely, especially out in the boonies where there is very little traffic. So much for a charming tolerant city.

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One time I was driving down Locust Avenue and there was this middle aged guy on a bicycle sticking way too far out into the road, making it so that none of us cars had enough room to get around him because we'd wind up in the other lane and into oncoming traffic. So traffic was backed up, like, ten or more of us cars, stuck behind this clown as his chubby legs vigorously pumped up and down, obliviously peddling away halfway out in the road.

This guy rides regularly down Locust, after 5 pm, so I take it he's commuting. And it wasn't the first time he's caused cars to be backed up behind him as tries to heave ho himself down the road on his bike. But that was probably the worst example, because there was so much oncoming traffic that none of us were able to get around him. And he couldn't have cared less either. Totally oblivious to what was going on behind him. So if he's reading this.........take note. Don't act like a clown. Get yourself over to the side. I'm so so so tired of rude, oblivious people getting in others' ways.

Rant for the day.

Kudos to Sgt. Durrette. I respect bicyclist and give them leeway, but they ride like idiots. When they slam into a car, it is always the car's fault. They need to obey the same traffic laws cars do, if they expect the same right of ways and what not. Thank you Sgt. Durrette for enforcing the laws of the Commonwealth. Bet you would never expect someone with my name to thank the police. First time for everything I guess.

What's wrong with thanking the police? Every day I thank the Charlottesville Police Department, the Albemarle County Police Department, and the Alexandria Police Department for everything they have done for me! :)

A year or so ago, right after the Tour de France (!) I was driving toward town on Reas Ford Road, approaching the bridge over the Rivanna. As I get on the bridge a clump of about 20 bicycles comes from the other side. They were riding three abrest. One, who didn't seem content to stay in the pack crossed the center line right in front of me. What was I supposed to do, hit a cyclist or a concrete bridge rail? Luckily, the IDIOT got over in time. This happens all too often on the country roads and they don't care, because who is going to catch them? Obviously, they think the cars are supposed to watch out for them, and we do, but there are times when they leave us very little alternative. Hostile towards bikers? How about being afraid that one day I will hit one of them who is being unsafe?

...not wanting to harm/kill myself or another person means I need therapy? Being extra cautious around bicyclists means I need therapy? Silly me, I thought that's what bicyclists wanted from us. Guess I'll stop. :) I mean, accidents happen. I'm sure the judge will feel the same way when I use that argument.

I find it hilarious and pathetic that you keep reverting to the state of my mental health when know little more about me than my first name. Find a different argument - your ignorance is showing.

I do complain/worry about the people who fly down the country roads here. It doesn't stop me from going to work every day (which is the kind of thing that would warrant psychiatric attention). But it's easier to prove who was being irresponsible when it's two vehicles. When it's a vehicle and a bike, the favor begins on the cyclist's side. I've been working in insurance for years...I see the outcome of these cases. Very, very rarely does a motorist get the benefit of the doubt in motorist vs. cyclist (or pedestrian) cases.

Here's the bottom line, as far as I'm concerned: Bravo to Durette for issuing the ticket. Shame on the cyclist for laughing as if it's not an issue to be taken seriously.

Have fun, kids.

Times have changed. When I was taught to ride bikes, we rode with the traffic flow and followed the same laws as all the other traffic (pedestrian, cycles, autos). What happened?

With bike lanes, biking is no longer cheap for the community. Extra pavement, extra lines, extra monitoring, less parking. The environment is not as healthy with all of these changes - and with the added cost who pays?.

The speed limit in most of Charlottesville is 25-35 mph, a speed which a bike can travel (cycles and scooters do).

Pedestrians have to wait for the light if there is one at the intersection, they cannot "trip it".

If everyone obeys the law, what is the problem in Charlottesville? Pedestrians, bikes, motorized vehicles - if all follow the law we are okay. (Albemarle county is a different situation).

A biker that is holding up traffic would do well to pull over and let the cars go by. That is just common sense.

Compared to motor vehicles, pedestrians and bicyclists have a slower top speed, generally operate over shorter overall distances, and are also more vulnerable in the event of a collision.

Consequently, laws are in place protecting both the health of peds/bicyclists, as well as the need (right?) of these same people to transport themselves across the earth's surface (using the tranpsort mode that the can afford, or prefer I suppose).

Personally I support obey these laws, of course applied with a layer of common sense on either side of the car/bike divide.

My request: before an automobile driver complains about the short delay caused by a commuting (or recreational cyclist), they should think about how long it'll take for them to "make up their lost time"....I personally think the same argument applies to giving the right of way to a ped in a cross walk (ones without green/red walk lights)... Of course I'd also ask the same person to think about the safety of not only other drivers, but pedestrians and bicyclists as well that could be affected by their behavior/attitude.

I personally like crosswalks, bike lanes, 25mph streets, sidewalk access (along streets and God forbid into and across car parking lots), because I think it improves the quality of life for everyone, note just those that must (or choose to) cover short distances on foot or with a bike rather a car.

Maybe these people just like the fresh air or increased chance for social interaction, maybe they're cheap and don't want to incur cost of buying, insuring (BTW i recommend that bikers carry personal liability insurance), fueling, maintaining a motor vehicle, or maybe they think it helps local and global air quality, or maybe it's all of the above...

...I just ask you to please recognize/don't forget what I believe to be some pretty basic rights/needs of people to "get around".

Zombie, I don't honestly know what Tito was driving on this day. But the boots mean nothing. I have seen him wearing his boots while driving his unmarked car on numerous occasions.

Furthermore, Tito doesn't have to "hide" anywhere in his new unmarked car, the car does all the work for him! Whether we agree with it or not, and as far as generating income, Tito's car is probably the best investment Chief Longo has made in a long time.

There's another new unmarked car working radar a lot in the city now too. But it's the typical white unmarked Crown Victoria police car, you can spot it from a mile away.

As a cyclist I am happy to see the laws being enforced. Those cyclists that don't abide that laws give us a bad reputation and are a hazard to pedestrians, drivers, AND other cyclists.

Learn to be patient? Ya see, there's the attitude!...... "I am riding up this hill on this 45 mph curve and I am doing the best I can to do 7 mph, learn to be patient."

In the meantime another car comes into the blind curve at 45 mph and doesn't realize I have basically been forced to pretty much stop in the roadway by a bicycle going 7 mph.

Luke-It's not the amount of time it takes to find a place to get around the cyclists, it's the fact that even if I'm going the speed limit around a curve, I could come around the curve and there be cyclists in the middle of my lane. No one is really disoberying the law, but it would be very easy for me or someone else to run into a cyclist because of the small size of the roads. Especially out in the country where I live. It's nothing to pop a hill or come around a curve and there be a gaggle of cyclists in the road and I've had to slam on my brakes many times for that situation. I think it's great if they want to get the exercise or whatever they're doing, however, the intent of the highways and roads are to provide service to motorized vehicles and even if I'm obeying all the rules of the road, the cyclists could cause a problem by just not being seem and there being no way to be seen in those situations. They need to go somewhere they can see other motorists or riders and where THEY can be seen.

:chuckle: You paint a pretty picture, Gasbag. What I don't get is why the vast majority of my encounters with cars are neutral or positive -- even when they get delayed a little -- yet you seem to be incapable of figuring out how to drive? Seriously. It's you. And the idiot in the blue Honda with the SOCA sticker. He doesn't get it either.

anything to discourage bicycling, right?

anything to discourage bicycling, right?

Pedaleur, I have had an absolutely spotless driving record my entire life. As I tell people repeatedly, I've never even had so much as a parking ticket. I have always been able to avoid the killing and maiming of cyclists and pedestrians that find themselves in front of my motorized vehicles. (The pedestrian encounters ALWAYS involve them paying no attention whatsoever to Don't Walk signal devices.)

Above I was actually speaking of a traffic accident that happened two nights ago. One of my nephews came upon a bicycle on a curve on Old Lynghburg Road. He was doing the speed limit and the bicycle was in his lane doing much much less. My nephew laid on the brakes, swerved, lost control and ended up ditching his vehicle. He was lucky in not being killed when the vehicle flipped and the roof caved in. All because some nut is riding a self propelled low speed bicycle on a public highway.

If my nephew had been doing 7 or 8 mph in his vehicle and a car ran into the back of him in this same curve, my nephew would be charged with obstructing traffic. Funny how this law does not apply to slow moving bicycles.

With each smug comment you make, I am losing more respect for bicyclists.

"... on a public highway."

That kind of ends the discussion right there, doesn't it? It's a public highway, and you have the duty to drive responsibly. As tough a lesson as it is for your nephew (no, I don't wish bad on anybody), he needs to learn to drive within his vision and his control. (Given the number of speed warning signs, I also doubt the veracity of his/your version of events, but that's another matter.)

You can go on and on all you want about my smugness -- though someone who uses "Gasbag Self Ordained Expert" as a moniker should first cast a glance in the mirror. Take a bike ride with me some day, and you'll quickly understand the grossly overplayed image of the "arrogant cyclist."

1- If you are driving within your means, there is no such thing as a blind curve.

2- OK

3- See #1. Cycling is actually a very safe form of transportation. Riskier than driving, but not by a whole lot. The side-benefits greatly outweigh the risks, in my self-ordained expert opinion.

4- Possibly. In the cycling world we call this the "Single Witness Suicide Swerve" defense, which is used as a Get Out of Jail Free card for drivers in such cases. Still, it can be hard to get out of fault in a rear end collision, however anti-cyclist the judge/jury may be, and I'd like to hear the cyclist's take on the matter before I pass judgement. In any event, _your nephew should be commended for "taking one for the team," regardless of fault_.

5- See #1 and #3. The risk is not really that high, but it can be a lot of fun. It's a shame that we've become a Bubble Wrap society that cowers in fear in the corner instead of getting out and enjoying ourselves. Cycling would probably be a great activity for many people. If my experience means anything, it would make people better drivers, as well, in the same way that learning a foreign language makes one better at English.

Safe travels!

@GSOE - I doubt you'll fill in the specifics - wouldn't want to post any incriminating details - but very little of Old Lynchburg Road - even all the way out to Plank Rd - is marked as even as high as 55mph. Many sections, though they have fun, tempting-to-go-fast-on curves, are clearly not suitable for the top posted speed, unless you're really skilled.

If your nephew is traveling at speeds where he can't successfully execute an emergency safety stop for some obstruction ahead of him in the road: slow moving cyclist, farm tractor or fallen tree - it really doesn't matter - then he needs to slow down or learn how to drive. That's reckless driving, period:

"§ 46.2-861. Driving too fast for highway and traffic conditions.

A person shall be guilty of reckless driving who exceeds a reasonable speed under the circumstances and traffic conditions existing at the time, regardless of any posted speed limit. "

I'm sure as a LEO you've written more than one of those for yahoo behavior, now, haven't you?

I call BS on your just-so story. I think it sounds like yet another not-paying-attention teenager driving way too hot for his not-so-great mad-skillz. It has nothing to do with cyclists. I've been biking on that road since the 70s and I've also had the same kind of chuckle-headed punks do dumb stuff like that when I've run a tractor down that road and on 20S. I've also been a chuckle-headed young punk, so I know whereof I speak. Sorry your nephew trashed his car, glad he's not hurt, and hopefully he'll learn his lesson and drive more safely (within his personal margin of error) in the future.

Scott, traffic enforcement was never one of my primary duties while working in the city. I am glad you mentioned it though. Because one ticket I did write ties right into this subject, I wrote a summons for reckless driving in front of Rugby McIntyre Apartments on the "blind curve" when a motorist passed me in my unmarked car. Had there been a cyclist in the other lane he would have been hit headon by this car that was passing me.

Even while working my last few years in the profession as an auxiliary deputy at Greene County, I never subscribed to the theory that "law enforcement" consisted of sitting in crossovers and writing speeding tickets all night long. As a matter of fact, several of the full time and several of the auxiliary deputies competed with one another to see who could write more tickets per shift. There was plenty of traffic enforcement without me even considering it.

I was headed to University Ave from Preston Avenue. I had slowed to about 15 mph as I came into the curve. The knucklehead behind did not like this and passed me. I was driving an unmarked 1972 Plymouth Gran Fury, so this had to have been at least 35 years ago. I don't even recall what the judge did with the charge. Most likely reduced it to improper driving. But the point remains, if there had been cyclists in the other lane there is no way on God's Green Earth he could have avoided hitting them. His being in the wrong lane at the time truly makes this one of those "blind curves" Pedaluer claims doesn't exist.

Wait. This is your definition of a blind curve? And this is your rationale for removing cyclists from public roads?

This is such a bizarre argument I can't possibly reply without sounding outrageously smug.

Enjoy your day. Please drive safely, everyone!

I almost forgot: to the cyclist in the original picture, if you're going to wear a helmet, you need to adjust it properly. Having it tilted back on your head like that greatly reduced its effectiveness. You should be able to see easily the brim of the helmet when fitted properly.

Lucid, sorry not to get back to you; I've been away from my computer. As I stated in an earlier post, I am not a cyclist. Haven't ridden a bike in thirty years or so, in part because it got to be too dangerous for my liking; so I never wonder "why motorists don't like cyclists". But thanks for the tip. If I ever do wonder about such a thing I'll just go look at myself in the mirror for awhile, since it apparently works for you.