Unanimous vote: City Council lowers nighttime noise law to 55dB
Write a letter to the editor
Bel Rio, 8am, August 17: quiet for now.PHOTO BY HAWES SPENCER
Just five months after lowering the limit from 75 to 65 decibels, City Council voted unanimously Monday to lower the late-night noise level restaurants are allowed to emit to 55 decibels.
The August 16 action brought a wave of applause in the first row of City Council Chambers; and it came despite the recent demise of the Belmont neighborhood restaurant that had been responsible, according to Council’s discussion, for 100 percent of the recent sound complaints.
According to a city report, the recent noise complaints were rendered moot— though certainly not mute— because the readings measured the offending noise at an average of 58 decibels, which is above the new limit. Something that was recently rendered both moot and mute was Bel Rio restaurant, which inexplicably went out of business in July.
Bel Rio, and a predecessor restaurant at that site called Saxx Jazz Club, featured musical performances on a small stage with thumping bass that disturbed the sleep of many Belmont neighbors who waged a long-running campaign to enact a stricter noise ordinance. When the 65dB limit was first debated in February, many seemed wary of the 55dB level.
Back then, Councilors heard from Jim Baldi, the owner of Bel Rio, who said that a man with a decibel meter found that merely opening the door to the City Council chambers registered 62 decibels. Since then, however, Baldi’s star has fallen, as he’s vanished amid an Albemarle police investigation that includes an arrest warrant for him on an embezzlement charge
The only City Councilor to express much reservation about Monday’s sound clampdown was David Brown, who said it seemed like a “broad tool to deal with one particular business.” Mayor Dave Norris noted that a recent code redefinition amounts to a ban on nightclubs (which the zoning code calls “music halls”) and may actually bring more benefit for noise-averse residents. Nonetheless, Norris joined the other four Councilors in amending the noise ordinance.
The law only applies to sounds emitted from 11pm to 6am in the so-called Neighborhood Commercial Corridors, which currently exist only in the Belmont and Fontaine neighborhoods.
In another closely-watched issue, Council also unanimously voted to ban panhandling near the two automobile crossings over the Downtown Mall. During a public comment session, the Council heard from Downtown Business Association Director Bob Stroh, who favored the ordinance in the name of safety. The Council also heard from recent City Council candidate Paul Long, who opposed the ordinance in the name of freedom.
One thing that came up just moments before the panhandling vote is that the amended ordinance— which now bans any solicitation within 50 feet of the crossings at 2nd Street West and 4th Street East when they’re open for traffic— will actually ban musical busking in those areas. That was zoning director Jim Tolbert’s interpretation, yet all five Councilors nonetheless voted their support for the ban.
After the vote, a man stood up to blast the move as an attack on the society’s unfortunate. “It is only going to be enforced against the very poor people,” said the man. “They have every right to be there and solicit contributions. I am more than disappointed; I am angry.”
Councilor Satyendra Huja then defended that vote, as did Holly Edwards, the latter of whom cited a Biblical passage and pointed out that this Council has enacted several measures aimed at bolstering human livelihoods in the hope of obviating the need to beg.
In other actions Monday, the Council appropriated funds for new police cruisers, a set of nine Ford Crown Victorias to be purchased from Crossroads Motors of Virginia, Inc., which won a recent bidding process with a price of $225,400— or $25,044 each.
The Council also enacted a new slate of building code fees including $400 to gain a temporary certificate of occupancy, $100 to petition the Building Code Board of Appeals, and a fee equal to double the normal building permit fee after a contractor has been hit with a stop-work order.
Finally, the Councilors voted to repeal 50 percent of the increased property tax from a planned $20 million downtown development by Waterhouse LLC. Designed by architect Bill Atwood and marketed by Great Eastern Management, the project was envisioned as the new home for Worldstrides travel company. Criticism has already been aired in the Daily Progress for a development which merely lures workers from Albemarle County into Charlottesville. Nobody spoke out against the special grant to a private business, and Council unanimously approved the the tax repeal, which will last for five years.
– story updated 9:03am Tuesday, August 17 with photo and a little more background on noise law
Mr Brown seemed to forget that 3 restaurants have now been at the center of noise complaints in that section for 4 years. It started with La Taza, then moved on to Saxx, and then Bel Rio. The Easters seemed bent on having rowdy crowds one way or another. Obviously some people and their patrons need to understand that this was just not the place for late night loud screaming and yelling.
The fact is, these places could not compete with the suiperior surroundings, and that’s not the residents’ fault.
What I really don’t get is why this Council, one claiming to be Democratic, thinks that the 50k of a business owner is worth more than the 50k + of a resident? What, a resident who puts down bucks to by a home and invests in it is less worthy than somebody like Jim Baldi?
Yeah. Right.
the only thing loud in Belmont is Allison Ruffner.
Don’t sit on your porch and talk after 11pm, Belmont. You might get cited.
So does the ordinance apply to peoples AC units? They are almost ALL over 55db……
50 dB refrigerator
50 - 75 dB washing machine
50 - 75 dB air conditioner
50 - 80 dB electric shaver
55 - 70 dB dishwasher
60 - 85 dB vacuum cleaner
60 - 95 dB hair dryer
65 - 80 dB alarm clock
75 - 85 dB flush toilet
80 dB ringing telephone
110 dB baby crying
90 - 115 dB subway
120 dB ambulance siren
130 dB jackhammer, power drill
130 dB percussion section at symphony
140 dB airplane taking off
95 - 110 dB motorcycle
110 dB symphony concert
110 dB car horn
110 -120 dB rock concert
112 dB CD player on high
117 dB football game (stadium)
150 dB firecracker
157 dB balloon pop
162 dB fireworks (at 3 feet)
163 dB rifle
166 dB handgun
170 dB shotgun
http://condor.admin.ccny.cuny.edu/~ms6785/page4.html
Tired of Caesonia -
Do you have proof that Allison Ruffner is Caesonia? Would you care to demonstrate how you have proof of that?
turn it down!,
Normal conversation 55 dbs. Are you saying there is problem in expecting people to have normal conversations after 11PM?
All residential areas in Charlottesville have ordinances limiting the sound to 55bs after 11PM.
Very Old Timer,
If you would like to complain about an AC unit in your neighborhood, do so. Have a sound measurement taken at the property line. If it can be measured above 55dbs, they can be cited. The rules are there. Go do it. Or do you just want to be sarcastic because a little bit of civil conduct is being forced on the guests who have been trashing a neighborhood for the last 5 years?
Are they using the A or C weighting scale, fast or slow response? These numbers are meaningless unless the scale is defined. Would someone please tell the public which they are using as their reference. A meter measuring 55 C weighted will likely fall to approx 52 A weighted..
Yes I AM being sarcastic. I think the entire argument is ridiculous. Belmont was a white trash depository with a few nice houses mixed in. Now it is a snobberium of people who think that it is not a dump. Putting a chandileer in an outhouse does not make it a dining room.
If I had a club in that neighborood and was attacked I would go around with my meter and create just as big a problem for the complainers as they did for me.
This whole thing has been blown up by a small group of people who have sleep disorders due to other issues in their lives.
Probably nothing that couldn’t be fixed with a weightloss program a paper bag and an overdose of viagra.
50 - 75 dB washing machine
50 - 75 dB air conditioner
50 - 80 dB electric shaver
55 - 70 dB dishwasher
60 - 85 dB vacuum cleaner
60 - 95 dB hair dryer
65 - 80 dB alarm clock
75 - 85 dB flush toilet
80 dB ringing telephone
110 dB baby crying
90 - 115 dB subway
120 dB ambulance siren
130 dB jackhammer, power drill
130 dB percussion section at symphony
140 dB airplane taking off
95 - 110 dB motorcycle
110 dB symphony concert
110 dB car horn
110 -120 dB rock concert
112 dB CD player on high
117 dB football game (stadium)
150 dB firecracker
157 dB balloon pop
162 dB fireworks (at 3 feet)
163 dB rifle
166 dB handgun
170 dB shotgun
So none of these can happen after 11PM….or you get cited…interesting
very old timer,
All your response reminds us is WHY there had to be a sound ordinance.
Your labeling and complete dehumanization for the residents whose lives have been overturned for your pleasure and that of other non-resident rowdies is
So if they are white trash or snobs - and who are you to judge -, does that make it OK to use their yards as toilets? Scream outside their windows? Vandalize their cars or property? Does the inhabitant of any neighborhood have to meet a certain background check to be allowed to be treated with common courtesy for the safety of their person and their property and to be allowed to sleep unmolested in their homes by business patrons?
Let us know, Grand Master, so the Belmonters can live the quality of you deem acceptable for them in their ghettos, along with their supporters like Mas Tapas.
Some woman lives for 40 years in a neighborhood and never has trouble sleeping until a few of these clubs which were supposed to be restaurants open now suddenly has a ’sleeping disorder’ and needs viagra? That’s like saying someone with a knife in their back has a pain disorder.
I’d say that those upset by the ordinance have a hearing disorder. Get hearing aids. The respect disorder will need more work. Maybe the ordinance will help start the process to recovery.
If not, do it in your own neighborhood. Where you sleep. Obviously your own nest is far superior to that of Belmont, and you wouldn’t want to be heard hanging out with such trash.
Or won’t your neighborhood wear a Bel Rio?
whatevea!
Make a silly statement, get the response you deserve.
“So none of these can happen after 11PM….or you get cited…interesting”
Seen anybody getting cited in the other residential neighborhoods of Charlottesville for running a vacuum after 11PM in their home?
“163 dB rifle
166 dB handgun
170 dB shotgun”
These get you arrested, not cited.
Do yourself a favor. Read the City Code before you try and make a point through sarcasm. Your ignorance just makes you look like a complete idiot and destroys your credibility.
Old Timer, I understand your position. But I think very old timer’s cynicism might come from the fact that a 55 dB rule won’t in and of itself stop vandalism, public urination, etc. from the late night rowdies.
I think the City (and ourselves) should ask the tougher questions. Is our concern really the late night noise? Or is it the negative externalities caused from nightspots being in a (mostly) residential neighborhood? Solutions to these 2 problems are much different.
Lastly, is it possible to quantify this at all? How many people have complained about noise? Is it 5 or 6 or are whole blocks taking action and petioning the city? My guess is that a relatively few number of people have complained so I’m guessing the City is throwing them a bone with a weak and difficult to enforce noise ban. Belmont still appears to be a neighborhood where some people want to live and I’m guessing the City doesn’t want to rock this boat and is unwilling to rezone to kick the restaurants out.
manbearpig,
I agree with you that the noise ordinance won’t stop all the vandalism or misbehavior. But because I have gone through in another location I can tell you that late night over amplified music combined with alcohol does have a direct correlation with it. Having spoekn with some of the neighbors what I experienced was very similar to what they experienced.
And similar noise concerns due to music/alcohol can easily be found in many different places:
http://www.thevillager.com/villager_82/barnoiseandtraffic.html
http://noisyneighbors100.blogspot.com/
http://www.valleycentral.com/news/story.aspx?id=428345
http://articles.mcall.com/2010-08-10/news/mc-bangor-noise-ordinance-20100810_1_noise-ordinance-president-craig-roberts-car-alarms
http://www.boston.com/yourtown/brookline/articles/2010/03/31/brookline_considering_stricter_noise_ordinance/
When it was just Mas and the BBQ and Taza closed early you didn’t hear any complaints. No one seems to complain about Tavola at this time.
“Is it 5 or 6 or are whole blocks taking action and petitioning the city? My guess is that a relatively few number of people have complained.”
Well, there is an old rule of thumb from industry; for every one complaint you receive, you can bet there are twenty more with the same complaint who didn’t say anything. I can tell you I know there are more than 4 or five people complaining, even if they aren’t showing up at City Council. You can also be sure that the complaints get fewer the further you are from the source.
My understanding is that group of people predate all the restaurants, and all those homes predate the restaurants. Belmont as a rule has lived in harmony with it’s businesses, a few newcomers shouldn’t be allowed to come in and upset an entire culture just because they want to be cool, or can’t make it on their original business plan.
Even if it were four or five people, does that make it OK? Should you have to move after 40 years because a few businesses don’t want to take responsibility for their decision to establish something right next door to a residence, a residence that might be zoned residential?
Is it OK to torture people even if it’s only four or five? Because I tell you something. What was happening mimics exactly the way in which the CIA and Army use music as a weapon of war and a no-touch torture item. Sleep deprivation and continuous sensory bombardment break people down faster than anything else.
The simple fact of the matter is that if the civil misconduct and over amplified music hadn’t been there, no one would have asked for a noise ordinance. People aren’t bad guys for standing up to those who disrespect them.
I guess nobody gets drunk after a night at MAS and pukes in peoples yards. I guess nobody ever got into an argument at MAS and carried it down the street.
There are laws on the books and taxes to pay for cops. THe laws agasinst public urination and vandalism are fine with me.
The sound level at 55db is too low and I don’t believe that it will stand up in court because I don’t think the meter will read lower than 55db when the music stops if an A/C unit is nearby.
We will see. I am entitled to my opinion about Belmont which is expressed because the crybabies in Belmont preofessed about how great it now is thanks to them and the lipstick they put on a few pig houses.
The history of Belmont has been told from different points of view depending on which house you live in. The fact that cannot be denied is that there has never been a time in Belmont where the really nice houses exceeded the dumps. That is still true today.
I wonder if the Police will stand across the street fromn MAS on a busy night when every table is full with people talking and charge them with violating the law.
“The history of Belmont has been told from different points of view depending on which house you live in.”
No matter what one’s view of the noise ordinance is, the existence of the new restaurants in general, or of the progression (or regression) of Belmont, I think this is a statement we can all agree on!!
“Some woman lives for 40 years in a neighborhood and never has trouble sleeping until a few of these clubs which were supposed to be restaurants open now suddenly has a ’sleeping disorder’ and needs viagra?”
Thought that little blue pill created sleeping disorders….
“I guess nobody gets drunk after a night at MAS and pukes in peoples yards. I guess nobody ever got into an argument at MAS and carried it down the street.”
Apparently not. Otherwise you would have gotten complaints from those very same residents 2002-early 2006. That was before Saxx, Bel Rio, and la Taza decided to open a Tiki Bar.
“The history of Belmont has been told from different points of view depending on which house you live in. The fact that cannot be denied is that there has never been a time in Belmont where the really nice houses exceeded the dumps. That is still true today.”
No, the history of Belmont is generally rewritten by resentful people like who think going into a neighborhood to eat a meals gives you the right to do whatever pleases you to those who live there, or take whatever pleases you from them.
Belmont was THE first subdivision in Charlottesville, in the area now known as Downtown Belmont, and there isn’t an outhouse or shack being lived in. They got rid of those when they put plumbing in the early 20th century. It was the rest of Charlottesville living without indoor toilets.
“lipstick they put on a few pig houses.”
Boy, and you are so desperately angry that you don’t get to be a part of the pig pen. You sound awfully jealous that you were told you couldn’t keep your snout in the trough if you weren’t a pig in a pig house. You sound jealous of Mas too, the oldest trough in that section.
It must really bite when you squeal so loudly even the pigs won’t tolerate you. :>))
What’s stopping you from starting your own Bel Rio next to your house in your own neighborhood? At least then you’ll find that you won’t have to be doing it around the piggies.
Excuse me, the rest of Charlottesville living with outdoor toilets.
The noise ordinance has been passed. Bel Rio is gone. Why can’t you, Old Timer AKA Caesonia, leave Belmont alone? There are so many people that come to Belmont who love, treasure, and respect the neighborhood. Many of these people, myself included, live in the neighborhood and call Belmont home!! The only thing that is bringing down the property value in Belmont is the fear of living next to someone like you.
I pray that the positive energy is going to out way the negative energy that a handful of residents have managed to cast over an entire community.
Old Timer, I know that this has given you a sense of self-importance but I think that it is now time for you to move on and spend your energy on things that matter since this issue has been resolved. If this was a competition, you won. I think it is sad. I hope that your victory is sweet, but watch your back because karma is a b*tch. And watch your cat, I saw it eating a bird the other day.
and yes, i do know that i spelled “outweigh” wrong before anyone corrects me. iPhones are really small and hard to read.
@tired of Caesonia: “…iPhones are really small and hard to read.”: That’s what she said…
ummm…. good one
All the good bands will now be appearing in other towns, thank you, whilst you sit with your hands folded in your quiet neighborhood.
What “good bands” is Charlottesville going to miss out on now that the treasure that was Bel Rio is no more?
Belmont was neighborhood of railroad workers and other blue collars. Saturday mornings used to be filled with people out in the street working on their own cars and dumping the oil down the sewers.
This ordinance will most likely not change anything because people like casesonia cannot be satiated. I suppose the next target will be someone talking on a cell phone on a curb.
Your fairytale about belmont being the first neighborhood with indoor plumbing is a nice story but not true.
I thought Orchid was Tomas from Mas. Are Old Timer and Caesonia one and the same? I think they’re also Tomas. He’s the one who doesn’t want any competition.
very old timer– What do blue collar workers dumping oil in the sewers have to do with having a nightclub move in next to your house? Said nightclub playing loud music into the wee hours equates to someone speaking on a cellphone on the curb? You seem to have an emotional investment in perpetuating a bizarre and negative image of Belmont that says it’s doomed forever due to the actions of some past residents. Newsflash: Lots of people across this country used to do dumb s**t like dump oil. Lots of people are now smarter about stuff like that. Once again, the oil/Bel Rio connection escapes me.
I’ve experienced Belmont over many decades. For the life of me, I can’t understand how anyone can make the logical leap from the period when Belmont was experiencing high crime rates, to nightclubs being the cure for that problem. Your solution is not restaurants, not cafes, and not family grocery stores, but NIGHTCLUBS?
Things got better in Belmont due to many different reasons and circumstances. I’m against making any area yuppified and sterile (Fifeville, I’m looking at you!). That doesn’t mean that anarchy is the cure either. Is planning, compromise, and striking a happy medium outside of your comprehension level?
I’m only guessing here– but are you a musician who has posted similar negative hyperbole about the Carlton/Hogwaller area in the past?
A gentrified Hogwaller: that pig needs a boatload of lipstick…
While nois issues and panhandling may be “sexy” issues for people to get worked up over, maybe they should be paying more attention to things like the increase in building code fees that Council passed.
$400 for a “certificate of occupancy”? If I build a home, have to pay the city $400 for permission to move into it. Is there no limit to their passion for picking our pockets?
Someone posted a great comment on the Daily Progress story about panhandling.
“Whats the difference between City Council and the panhandlers on the Mall?
When you don’t give the panhandlers the money they ask for, they leave you alone.”
This debate has been going on for months. I didn’t start slamming Belmont until caseonia and others bragged about how they were entitled to quiet because they spent money fixing up their houses and saved belmont from its saddened state. Belmont is Belmont and will always be Belmont. It was never the noble place that they proclaimed. Ask some of the older blacks in this town whether or not they even had the nerve to enter belmont in the early 60s.
I feel that 55db is too low and unreasonable. I also think that the deck at MAS exceeds that from the cumulative voices gathered there on a crowded night.
I think a vocal few want to control things and the city gave in. I hope it backfires in their face.
I hope that whatever opens there next is a resturant with horrendous odors or loud delivery trucks at 6:00am so that these folks can get what they asked for.
Lofts right next to the subway in new york sell for 800k to start. Those people seem to sleep fine.
When they did not have their way this group was comprised of babies. Now that they got their way they are bullies.
With the new law in place we will see whether there are unintended consequences or not.
I have serious doubts that this group will all of a sudden have their sleep disorders resolved. They still have to live with the real reasons they cannot sleep.
55 db is entirely too low. The city should enforce the rules already on the book or find a way to get rid of the nightclub. This is just a symbolic change that will do little for the community and will not resolve the core problem: People don’t want to live next to a nightclub.
“didn’t start slamming Belmont until caseonia and others bragged about how they were entitled to quiet because they spent money fixing up their houses and saved belmont from its saddened state.”
In all my reading of the comments over this long period, no one bragged about anything until the false claim that places like Bel Rio saved Belmont was posted over and over in forums like this. It was an insult to many residents who have over the last 20 years or so, invested via sweat equity/cash equity into their homes. All those people absolutely have a right to take pride in their efforts and defend it in the face of such absurdities such as nightclubs saving Belmont.
Whomever Caesonia is, he/she was hardly the only one to claim the residential investment as an important factor. Maybe the most vocal, but why is that a problem? It makes their points no less valid or untrue.It does however, appear to threaten individuals like you? Why is that?
You do realize that by making up all the false statements about Belmont and ignorant/belittling statements about railroad or blue collar workers you destroy any credibility you might have at all?
There are no outhouses with chandeliers along Hinton, Belmont,Graves, Douglas, and many other streets in that area. There are more humble homes as you go down the hill towards the stockyards, but you will also notice that there are no nightclubs or restaurants, other than Moore’s Creek, which has been there a long time.
I do agree with you that the investment thing shouldn’t determine a sound level. I also happen to hold that standard to business and resident alike. What should determine that is the basic humanity of treating people who live in an area with respect and dignity regardless of their socio-economic income or the value of their property. A small business should no more be run out by a few developers in cahoots with the City than the residents.
Apparently you have decided that only people of certain socio-economic classes have a right to a peaceful neighborhood.
Belmont has always been primarily residential, and that character hasn’t changed in over 100 years. Most homes there are zoned r-2 if you look at maps. Thus, I think that Belmont should be given the same treatment of other residential communities like Greenbrier, Park St, Greenleaf, Westwood/Rugby area. 55dbs. If you think it won’t stand up in court well, you had better start doing research because 55dbs is a residential standard all over the country.
What’s more, I happen to think its the residents and businesses there that should determine it. A general vote would have probably been better. The last people that have any right to determine what is right sound wise for any residential area are musicians from other neighborhoods and counties that slam their ear drums routinely with 90 dbs of sound in a small space.
Pretty much all I am hearing from you is a lot of sour grapes, and anger at a single blogger who has been very vocal about a few principles. That blogger worries you a great deal. Of credibility you have zero.
Aristotle,
I disagree the 55 dbs has no impact or that it is too low. We are talking after 11PM, not all day, and in an area where the houses bordering literally are zoned R-2 at 55dbs after 11PM, and 65dbs in the day.
I absolutely agree that zoning changes should occur to stop another nightclub. The city has recently made some. Enforcing rules are the most crucial issue in any case. The city waived certain zoning requirements , highlighted in the rezoning of a residence on Hinton.
Such actions have led to this conflict.
But current businesses are grandfathered in to the older zone rules, as anywhere else in the city. thus the current establishments have little incentive to not do what the nightclubs did except good sense.
Ordinarily I do not want to get sucked up in the annonymous
and high school-ish blogs, but want to
thank my neighbors who bravely and unselfishly and intelligently
stood up for the many residents who were disturbed by a few
noisy late night venues. It took time and courage and commitment.
These wonderful people spoke up for those who are tired, or disempowered,
or too busy earning a living for themselves and those they are supporting ( I can think of 3 such families right off the top of my head), are to be congratulated. Those living IN Belmont thank
those who took a stand, and did the right thing!
Want thumping noise and drinking late at night? Fine, have it at YOUR house! I am indebted to those who stood for my neighborhood.
Stop being sour grapes, those of you who invited restrictions.